UK Dub Files: Fatman International

Fatman, could you tell us how you started your own soundsystem?
Fatman: I-man came from Jamaica to the UK in 1962, and was moving around with other sounds, like the sound by the name of Sir Fanso. I was both selector and MC back then. Fanso decided to go back to Jamaica in the seventies and left me behind all alone. I was stranded and had nothing to do, so I built my own sound.

Could you tell us how the name Fatman came around?
Well, I was given the name Fatman. It's a funny thing, because at that time I wasn't even fat! I was a slim man back then. I had a friend, and I remember we were talking about what the sound should be called. He said "you should call the sound Fatman!" and Fatman Hi-Fi was born, you know?

So maybe you thought it would be good for business if you would grow fat also?
That's right! (laughs) It was called Fatman because it was a fat soundsystem, I was still a slim man then. The sound grew on to me.

Why do you think it's best to hear reggae music on a soundsystem?
Fatman was one of the first to really play the drum and bass, dub selection. You can't deliver the drum and bass on a low quality sound. To hear the roots coming out, you need a high quality sound. When we were playing, we used to play the vocal in the dance, and then the dub side. When we played the vocal, you noticed the crowd was all relaxed. When we played the version side, everyone went wild! That's when I realized the version speaks no language: it has no barriers, everyone understands it. Not everyone understands the vocal, you see? From then, these early days, we were really driving the drum and bass. Yes man! That's why we built a sound: you have to be able to deliver it.

If anyone has seen the music changing, it must be you. Do you have the impression digitalisation has changed reggae music?
I don't think so. The dub music of nowadays, the new drum and bass you talk about, doesn't change anything for the roots drum and bass. If the audience doesn't recognize the original when they come out to listen the new thing, they're satisfied with what they're hearing. But when they come and get the proper roots music, they realize there's something else to it, you understand? They start seeing the truth in it. This new style doesn't take away anything from the foundation. It's more like an educational thing: the new music leads the youths to the original.

When you played in the early days, you clashed with big names like Jah Shaka and Coxsone. But if you go to a big session in London like University of Dub these days, it's no clash thing.
Fatman: Well yes, nowadays it's not a competition anymore. When we were playing in those days, each sound would play exclusive music at that night. If Fatman clash with Coxsone, what Fatman play, Coxsone wouldn't be able to play. What Coxsone play, Fatman wouldn't be able to play. If Coxsone play what Fatman play or Fatman play what Coxsone play, we'd break that record and throw it away, it was no good anymore. So from early days, we were playing dubplates. Dubplates were very important for a sound to have, because they were exclusive music. Whenever we were playing on sound, we needed an amount of dubplates so we could play exclusive music in our corner. You see, these acetates were special versions of released songs that only the soundsystems could play.
DJ Flip: Different mixes, you see? People recognize the tune, but it's a different mix.
Fatman: That's right. I was the first to have dubplates because I had connections with all the big producers dem. I was right through. I was very close to King Tubby as well, as we worked together. I mixed most of my own productions personally in Tubby's studio, so I could play them on the Fatman sound later. Also, we'd often play tunes that we or close friends of us produced before they were released. People like King Jammy, Bunny Lee, Niney Observer, "Scratch" Perry... They produced records, and we would play them a year before they came to the street. Sometimes they never came to the street, and the music was exclusive to us! For example, when Channel One started out, I was the first one to play a big selection of Channel One. The dubs of Wailing Souls "Very well", Mighty Diamonds and thing like that... I was the first sound to play them! Me and Bunny Tom Tom from Channel One sat together and we cut dubs all night. He cut one for Channel One, one for Fatman, and so on all night. Then I came back to London, came inna dance and I would tear the place apart, you know?

In the early 90's, you stopped playing on the sound for a while and concentrated on producing. Were you growing tired of selecting?
Fatman: Never! I never stopped playing on the Fatman sound, but we did take a break. The crew I had at that time, didn't really want to go my direction, the roots way. Remember, I was always a roots sound. They wanted to do other things, they wanted to go dancehall. Now don't get me wrong, we don't only deal with roots, we play everything! Because right now if they call us for any type of dance, we can enter. You understand? We're very versatile, but roots is our main aim. At that time I-man slowed things down and I created my own selector, my son DJ Flip. He is one of the best in the universe!
DJ Flip: (laughs)

So Flip, the roots music came to you naturally?
Fatman: No, it wasn't just natural! He actually surprised me. In his first stages, he wasn't playing roots, he wasn't playing reggae, he was playing r'n'b! Yet he was studying from r'n'b, and then he came into the roots. When he came into the roots he knew everything!
DJ Flip: You probably think Fatman took a break because we were playing under the name of Goldstar Muzik  for a while. Goldstar was my initiative and played the dancehall style, but it was still a family thing, same way.
Fatman: That is how Goldstar come about: we didn't want to use the name Fatman for the dancehall stuff. But later on, we just divert everything into Fatman International!
DJ Flip: Back to the roots, you know? That's where the home is! That's where it start and it finish.
Fatman: Now Flip and I, we're gonna launch a new label and we're gonna be issueing quite a few things. 7 inches, 10 inches, maybe even LP's. We'll see how the market is going, because the roots market is a very hard market.

Roots music used to be all about unity, then it fell apart into different styles. Do you think these different scenes can still come together?
DJ Flip: Well personally, I don't think so. To a level, there is not really a division in the music. The dancehall DJ's still play a segment of the roots, but it's lighter roots. Not the deep roots the soundsystems play, you overstand? When we go roots, you don't hear no dancehall. It's strictly roots we play, that's how it is. So I don't really think the scenes should come together, it's more that the audience should be flexible.
Fatman: I agree with Flip when we're talking about the musical level of this matter. But on a soundsystem level, it's the soundmen who direct which way the dance will go. Whether it's a love dance or a war dance, a hate dance or a peace dance. If the sound system members of today can come with that unity within the dance, then the public will respect that unity. This is the way that we should work: we should promote each other. Just look at the dance tonight. All nationalities, you could see the message, the love... everything is there!